BREAKING NEWS – Judge rules on plaintiff’s EX PARTE application in AXANAR LAWSUIT

axanar-logo-3So my best one-sentence summary of Magistrate Judge Charles Eick’s ex parte order in the Axanar lawsuit would be: “Move along folks; nothing to see here.”  In other words, nothing really surprising happened (at least if you read my previous blog).

In short, the plaintiffs asked for three main things and got two and a half of them…maybe two and a quarter.  But the thing is, they got what the defense was already offering.  You order a drink, the waiter brings it.  Done.  So it was kind of anticlimactic.

Here’s the three things the plaintiffs wanted:

1. Alec Peters must sit for additional deposition questions concerning new e-mails that were just discovered by the plaintiffs on October 22

Here the defense had agreed for Alec to sit for up to two hours of questions.  The plaintiffs wanted no time limit.  The judge “split the pot” and gave them five hours…which should be plenty.  Both sides should be happy here.

2. The financials submitted by the defense should be de-designated by the court from “Highly Confidential” (lawyers’-eyes-only) to publicly available.

As I previously stated, there is a compromise between “Highly Confidential” and “Public,” and it’s simply “Confidential.”  The difference between “Highly Confidential” and “Confidential” is that in the case of the former, ONLY the attorneys in the case are allowed to see the document in question.  Remove the “Highly” and the parties themselves are allowed to review it, as well.  However, the document cannot be shared with the jury during trial unless the judge clears it later on.

This was kind of a win for the Axanar side since they had already offered to make Alec’s financial summary (the one prepared by the accountant, not the Quicken notes) simply “Confidential” and not “Highly Confidential.”  They just didn’t want it cleared for public review because of the risk that Axanar detractors would misuse or misrepresent the information to damage Alec Peters’ professional reputation…regardless of whether their accusations were true.  (Misunderstanding of proper accounting practices has already led to some incorrect conclusions and accusations from some quarters.)

Anyway, on this one, the judge agreed with the defense, although the plaintiffs did get the “Highly” removed.  So this was the “half” I was talking about earlier.

3. Defense must provide a privilege log.

Least surprising of all of the non-surprises today was this one.  The plaintiffs wanted a privilege log; the defense was willing to produce it.  The judge essentially said, “Great.  Do that, then.”  Well, that’s not exactly what he said, but it was the gist.

So is anyone doing a happy dance right now, and is anyone kicking the can dejectedly down the sidewalk?  Well, kinda.  It all comes down to this comment from the judge’s ruling:

Notwithstanding the issues Plaintiffs have raised regarding the adequacy of Defendants’ document productions (based largely on information obtained in connection with the depositions taken in October of 2016), the Court will not require at this late date the effective recommencement of document searches, reviews and productions.

What does this mean?  Well, the plaintiffs made a late request for additional searches and deliveries of e-mails, documents, social media postings, text messages, IM conversations, etc.   As I mentioned, the time to ask for all of this was in the Joint Stipulation Motion to Compel Discovery document filed with the court on September 29.  The plaintiffs waited an extra month to bring that stuff up.

Remember how I said previously that Magistrate Judge Eick was a stickler for proper procedure?  Well, note the “at this late date” phrase that he inserted into the ruling.  That was his way of saying, “You had your chance and blew it, dudes.”  (Yeah, I know.  Federal Circuit Court judges don’t use the word “dudes”…not even in Southern California.)  But trust me, I don’t think the inclusion of that little prepositional phrase was an accident.

Honestly, I don’t know if the plaintiffs ever really expected to get all (or any) of that late-requested stuff.  One of my legal contacts commented that he/she believed it was probably just done for “show” by the plaintiffs to demonstrate to the studios how tough and aggressive the Loeb & Loeb attorneys are being.  After all, they’re charging CBS and Paramount a lot of money!  But that’s pure conjecture, of course.  Nevertheless, it was a pretty ballsy and aggressive heap of stuff to ask for with less than a week left to produce it all.  And I’m sure the judge realized that, as well, and didn’t want to burden the defense unnecessarily.

And it’s not that awful of news for the plaintiffs, either.  As was stated in the most recent documents filed with the court, all social media posts are publicly available anyway.  It’s just now, if the plaintiffs want to fish for something juicy, they need to row out on the lake with their poles and fish (search for stuff) themselves.

There’s also a big silver lining for the plaintiffs right now.  If you read the judge’s order, you’ll notice no sanctions against the plaintiffs.  I’d say, “Whew!  Dodged a bullet there…” except that the bullet was more of a poorly hit badminton shuttlecock.  (Sounds worse than it is.)  In other words, sanctions are seldom imposed unless one side or the other does something really bad.  That said, if this is only a taste of the future behavior of the plaintiffs’ attorneys, the next judge ahead of them is the Honorable Robert Gary Klausner…and from what I hear, he doesn’t put up with shenanigans either.

So what’s next?  Well, today the two sides are meeting for a court-ordered settlement discussion, facilitated by Magistrate Judge Eick.  There’s no requirement for the sides to settle, but if they do–game over, man.  No trial, and none of us will likely know what they agreed to.  If they don’t settle, then expect a quiet three months (but still keep visiting FAN FILM FACTOR–because there’s more to fan films than just Axanar, folks!) and then the trial begins on January 31.

Happy Halloween!

122 thoughts on “BREAKING NEWS – Judge rules on plaintiff’s EX PARTE application in AXANAR LAWSUIT”

  1. I know you didn’t comment on it in your article, but where you posted the article, but good job comparing and contrasting how you write your stories vs. how Pedraza writes his.

    1. The problems with DISCO involve many things but NOT the AXANAR lawsuit. First, Fuller over-committed to projects and couldn’t be in three places at once. This delayed DISCO. Also, so many productions are moving to Toronto that there aren’t enough qualified tradesmen (camera and lighting people, make-up artists, gaffers and electricians, sound engineers, etc.) to staff them all. Professionals from L.A. want to relocate but can’t get work visas fast enough because bureaucracy in Ottawa is about as bad as it is here. So DISCO got delayed…significantly. CBS can’t afford another delay; it’s too embarrassing for one thing, and there’s cost associated with not delivering on time (such as lost revenue from all those months that All Access isn’t generating more subscribers or waiting longer for the next check from Netflix for season two).

      1. …i’ve heard the “official story”, and it makes sense, but i still don’t believe it

        …i think CBS hates Star Trek; and Fuller, who has been supportive of Axanar, is on his way out (driven also, by the cluster**** that is CBS-trek)

        CBS should reconsider licensing the new series to Netflix, where it would be PROPERLY handled and appreciated! =D

  5. I am looking forwatd to your analysis of Costumes and Candy from lawsuit participants and the ramifiactations on the case….. 🙂

  6. So, the plaintiffs swung for the fence, but only got a stand up single.

    Am I correct in assuming that if there is a settlement, we should know by this time tomorrow?

  7. According to Alec Peters,
    They made progress in the Settlement Negotiations today, and we could see a settlement by the end of the week.

  8. …i’ve heard the “official story”, and it makes sense, but i still don’t believe it

    …i think CBS hates Star Trek; and Fuller, who has been supportive of Axanar, is on his way out (driven also by the clusterf*ck that is CBS-trek)

    CBS should reconsider licensing the new series to Netflix, where it would be PROPERLY handled and appreciated! =D

  9. I am shocked Jonathan….”utterly” shocked (no cows were harmed in the making of this post)….that Judges in Southern California do not say “dude”….I was completely lied to by my album covers…

    From reading above…..remind me not to say, “great piece”again…. great assessment of the proceedings though (try to twist that one 😉 )

    He’s to the best agreement that can be made. I know Alec won’t let us down…

  10. Hey Jonathan, Why don’t you ask Alec what happened to all the listed donors from the Retro Active Donors list went. Hundreds of listed donors names disappeared from Axanar Productions Donor Roster including mine. There are a few hundred names gone that had been there as of May 2015. The list was scrubbed from the donor roster page before the lawsuit. So, What the HELL happened to it??? Huh Alec???

    2. Well Rand, when Terry McIntosh got up and left the production and deleted all of our files and didn’t give us any of the Ares Digital Donor information, we had to rebuild everything from scratch. So some things got prioritized. At least Bill Watters, our new CTO did in 2 months what Terry couldn’t complete in 10.

      So maybe direct your anger at Terry not us. I have asked Bill to jump on this with Diana. Of course you could have asked me directly since you have my email and I would have seen to it. Posting your displeasure without contacting the people who can actually solve your problem isn’t very productive.

      Alec

      1. Alec, you keep blaming Terry for everything and take no responsibility for your own actions that led to him leaving nor are you taking responsibility for the fact thousands of donors names disappeared and an entire donor list has been missing for months. I wonder if I had not brought it up here it would likely still not be there. Only now that I have you decide to cover up the screw up with excuses. Well Alec, today I am not buying it and tomorrow doesn’t look good either.

        1. Ladies and gentlemen, Donald Trump is very proud of himself for getting President Obama to turn over his birth certificate proving that he was born in America after all!

        2. Rand, Terry left because he refused to do the simple work he agreed to do a year earlier. He refused to finish Ares DIgital, refused to allow us to get someone else to do it, then ILLEGALLY deleted all of our files and refused to give us all the donor data he had collected on our behalf. So stay out of business you know nothing about.

          And thousand of donor names are NOT missing from the donor list, that is an outright LIE.

          If you had been an adult and emailed me, the solution that Bill Watters (our current competent and accountable CTO) put in place immediately could have been handled without all your high school drama.

          Alec

      2. Not exactly Alec! Here’s Terry’s side of the story:

        Terry McIntosh So, here are the facts:

        I did not delete the donor lists. They cannot be deleted, because they’re downloaded directly from the fundraiser platforms themselves. They still have that. I still have that. Anything that I imported in to the Ares Digital (my system and not their recreation) went with me when I took my toys and left. Alec is just pissed that he had to pay to have someone do that work again instead of trying to weasel that from me without compensation. Ares Digital — the name, the domain name, and my software and effort — are my exclusive property and that is in WRITING via email and Facebook PMs, so Alec can piss his pants however he chooses, but the facts cannot be denied by anyone.

        Also in writing, the Google Drive was my personal account that I was paying for out of my own packet for nearly two years. When I left I gave them a few weeks to get their bits moved wherever they chose to, and in usual Alec fashion nothing was done. True to my word I pulled the plug when I said that I would and then he, again, pissed his pants. Not my problem if you or your new geek didn’t take me at my word… don’t put off for tomorrow that which you can do today, and all that jazz.

        AD — conceived of, built, named, and owned by me exclusively. I had considered, and there was talk, of bringing Alec in as a partner in that effort where he would sell it and I would code it moving forward, but when I saw how he behaved himself after the C/P lawsuit hit, especially with the public, how could anyone choose to go in to business with the guy? If he owned it, or had any interest in it, then he wouldn’t have made an offer to buy it with cash and/or stock, right? Logic 101 here, folks.

        Alec lies, manipulates, retcons reality, and claims to be flawless in one breath while crying the martyr in the other so often that if can give you whiplash. He’s weak, incompetent, vindictive, common, and talentless. He does know how to weave a web of bullshit though, so he does have something. Once people become aware of his ways they tend to run away quickly, as so many have with Axanar (and his previous ventures).

        You can find it here: https://www.facebook.com/groups/CBSvsAxanar/permalink/1352654978079202/?comment_id=1353246601353373&reply_comment_id=1353351301342903&comment_tracking={%22tn%22%3A%22R9%22}

        1. In the future, Sandy, I would prefer people post their own comments…not relay the comments of others. It’s not an “…or else your comment won’t get posted” rule. It’s just my preference. Other bloggers and blogs have their own preferences.

          1. Fair enough. He didn’t want to give you the traffic but was fine with me posting it. I just thought it was right to have both sides of the story instead of him getting dragged through the mud.

        2. …this is not drama, this is crappy soap opera =(

          …if this is accurate, and given that we aren’t told Terry’s reasoning for “taking his toys and leaving…” – it looks to me like [Terry] might be the source of this *GLITCH*; and IMO, looks like a dick

          I commend you Jonathan, for your patience and forthrightness in addressing this unfortunate trolling…

        3. Well, Terry is the liar here, since I was the one who conceived of Ares Digital as a solution for Backerkit that Diana was struggling with. I discussed getting a firm to build it and Terry volunteered to do it FOR US. He then took 10 months, failed to finish it, and when we asked for the data to get someone else to do it, he refused. Really, ANYONE at Axanar can vouch for this, and one person on the Axanar team (not me) is pushing me very hard to sue Terry.

          Terry has taken full responsibility for not getting Ares Digital done on Facebook. So he has admitted to his failure is public.

          I won’t get into Terry’s immature name calling. But I can say that EVERYONE at Axanar Productions is pissed at Terry and no one here would work with him again.

          Alec

          1. I wouldn’t worry about Sandy or Rand, Alec. They’re much like CBS/Paramount and looking for the first scapegoat they can find. When this is over and you’ve won they’ll crawl back to wherever they came from.

          2. I doubt it. Hate like that needs to live and breathe. If Alec wins, this’ll stick in their craw. They’ll never accept it. (Can you name the episode that quote is–almost–from?) 🙂

  11. I am willing to bet Plaintiffs would love to know what happened to the Retro Active Donor Roster as well… Ya think???

    2. Really? You think the plaintiffs care what donor list got deleted by Terry and what didn’t? Seriously?

      We are addressing, so relax.

      Alec

      1. Because I already posted and had more to say. Your blog has no edit post feature.

        I saw no reason to contact Diana Kingsbury as I have strong doubts she is even aware of it. Furthermore, Terry MacIntosh does in fact have records of donors on the Retroactive Donor list which I was listed on, I sincerely hope he turned over it to the plaintiffs. I used to be Alec’s biggest defender but after seeing how he started removing donors names in an apparent attempt to hide donor money he spent and to keep evidence of such from the plaintiffs, I see he is just a shady con artist as everyone as said. I never joined the haters group Jonathan and this is not coming from them. I found all this out my own and I will hate Alec from the comfort of my own home but just so you know I did make Carlos Pedrazza aware of it. Now we wait to see how far the rabbit hole goes.

        1. Wait a second, Rand, I just want to make sure I understand this. You contacted everyone EXCEPT the one person (Diana Kingsbury) who could actually do anything to track down and correct your issue? Now I’m very confused. I’m going to ask Diana to read this thread and comment, as well.

          1. Jonathan you don’t get it!!!! It was not just my name, it was hundreds of donors names on that list. The entire list is GONE!

          3. Let me chime in here a second Jon. I did an analysis of the donor list on the current Axanar page and a version from the Wayback machine from February and Rand is correct. The Retroactive Donor list is missing completely, but there is also in the region of 3000 less names in the current list. Considering they have still been accepting donations since Feb you’d think the list would grow and not shrink. Sure, there has been the occasional refund (like mine) but not 3000. So….

            Why has the list been scrubbed? Is Alec trying to hide how many donors there are?

          4. I doubt Alec is trying to hide donors. If that was his goal, why stop at just 3,000?

            It probably has more to do with the change-over of developers from Terry McIntosh to Bill Watters, but that’s just a guess from me. I’ve putin an e-mail to the Goddess of Fulfillment. Let’s wait to see the answer.

          5. So let me get this Rand, Terry deletes the donor list, as well as our entire Google Drive (violating the judges Legal Hold) and refusing to give us the Ares Digital that he developed for us, and then witholding all donor data, and you want to bitch at us about a donor list that has disappeared?

            We had to recreate EVERYTHING because of terry’s actions. And getting Ares Digital up and running was the priority.

            So if there is something missing, rather than bitching on here, you send me an email and I will address. That is what you SHOULD have done.

            Alec

          6. It’s not the number of donors that is important Jon, it’s which donors. The donor list had 4 sections, one for each fundraiser and one for the Retroactive donors. It’s all the retro donors (plus others) that are missing. Now the figures from the three crowdfunding campaigns would have been of great interest to the plaintiffs and probably has been turned over to them. If I was being sued and wanted to hide income from a potential settlement, scrubbing the retro donors who paid directly to PayPal (or in person at cons) would be a great way to do it. There is no prof of course.

            Fortunately this info and hypothesis has been passed to CBS and for Alec’s sake I hope he has turned over his PayPal accounts already.

            As far as Alec’s claim that the list changes are all Terry’s fault I call BS. I have archives from before and after he left and Terry is not the issue here.

          8. “Man, when the Axanar documentary is finally made, you guys are gonna look sooooooo ridiculous.”

            What’s that supposed to mean? Besides deflecting the question I can’t see the point. I’ll reiterate, I don’t know any of this was deliberate nor do I know money is being hidden. All I DO know is that it looks very bad and Alec can’t just explain it away that it was Terry’s fault since the roster was still there after he left. As I said, I’m sure the Plaintiffs will find everything they need to know from Alec’s financials, including his PayPal accounts. They’ll need the Propworx ones too of course, since the funds from the first Kickstarter went there “by mistake”.

            I think the idea of a documentary is hilarious though. Some people will do anything in an attempt to stay relevant. A smart man would accept defeat and just walk away….

          9. Well, that was a much more rational reply then many I’ve been seeing lately, Sandy. And I’ll leave it to Alec to address if he chooses to.

            The documentary, I think, is actually a pretty cool idea. This case has been very dramatic so far. It could be a very marketable film to try to sell…especially since the potential impact globally on the interpretation of copyright law could be significant…especially in the ever-changing world of new media and the constantly-evolving climate of cutting-edge technology for the masses. I could see the concept of an Axanar documentary being fairly easily sold, but that’s just me.

            And that leads conveniently to your last totally illogical comment “A smart man would accept defeat and just walk away….” Alec has not been defeated by any stretch. The studios wanted him to cry “uncle” back in January. It’s now November. That’s far from defeat. And if the case settles tomorrow, then Alec is farther ahead than he would have been at any earlier point in this entire process. Earlier settlement offers weren’t acceptable. So he probably won’t accept the same offer now. So he’ll get more if he settles…maybe not everything, but certainly more than he would have gotten back in January or even in June. That’s hardly defeat, my friend.

    2. What the deuce? I can’t speak for Alec or anyone else with the project, but I know many people have had issues with the original fundraisers (including myself) because Terry McIntosh decided to incorporate several different platforms into his own, apparently proprietary, system so he could create his own company. Unfortunately, as I had to have him correct several issues with my own account (like how he screwed up the lists, getting fulfillment done and then put in back doors to mess it up after he was fired) before he was replaced.

      Rand, if you want to turn your back on things that’s your prerogative – but do not expect me to stand by and have you badmouth the project and try to make it some sort of personal rift you have with Alec, when you know that isn’t. If you don’t want to reach out to ZDiana or others to remedy this, that’s all on you.

      1. Jeff, I am not even going to dignify you a response other than this. As for my badmouthing just let me say when you are no longer a lap dog for Alec you find out some amazing things.

        1. Of course, you find out more accurate things when you know Alec personally rather than just kvetching about him. For example, did you know that Alec coaches volleyball? 🙂

      2. Jeff Craig is crazy and a stalker. He didn’t like what I was saying on Twitter so tracked me down and placed a call from Washington state to my work office in the UK. What kind of freak does that. Alec likes to call us “hater” stalkers but he needs to look in his own house. This crosses a line.

        1. Sandy, I need to issue a warning now that Fan Film Factor will not be used to broadcast unsubstantiated accusations against anyone. If I see something like this again–it will not be approved. That goes for anyone else–whether it be about Alec, you, Terry, anybody. Substantiated is fine. Rand’s name really was missing from the donor list. But this accusation about Craig is simple hearsay from a single source about the alleged actions of another.

          And hey, would anyone like to talk about fan films…for a change? I’ve got an entire blog site filled with dozens and dozens of articles, interviews, and features about fan films that AREN’T Axanar. 🙂

          1. I can provide proof if you’d like Jon. He even Tweeted that he did it so the proof it there for the asking.

          2. Sure, let’s see the proof. I’ll also invite Hupcap Dave to provide his proof–since your two stories aren’t matching. Then we can have dueling proofs…just like back in high school geometry class! 🙂

          3. Jonathan, the proof he is offering isn’t about the donor list (though I’d like to know if his assertions on all that are based off the spreadsheet he made on 10/18), but about his accusation on Jeff.

        2. Probably the same kind of freak that trolls a blog like Fan Film Factor and tries to sell her viewpoint as the truth instead of starting her own blog.

    3. Rad, you have my email so if you want to talk, email me or message me. Don’t just post on a blog I rarely look at comments on and expect an answer.

      Alec

  15. Rand, the List on the website is generated off of a data table that’s not necessarily the most up-to-date donor database. It’s entirely possible that your name wasn’t deliberately removed from it by anybody. Please, contact Diana and she’ll be able to find out if your info is still in the donor database, which I’m almost certain it still is. Then she can get Bill Watters to see if there’s a glitch in the table that fills the webpage and fix it for you, ok?

    2. I cant believe you guys honestly expect me to believe Alec did not know about this??? Glitch in the system??? Reece read these words again and you as well Jonathan,

      IT WAS NOT JUST MY NAME! Close to and possibly over 3000 donors names removed. The ENTIRE RETRO ACTIVE Donor list scrubbed from the Donor roster and you guys think it wasn’t deliberate? What planet do you guys live on? OH wait that’s right…. AXANAR. Now you want to play it down like its a coincidence. That a heap of crap you guys are shoveling. One big stinky mountain of CRAP!
      HOLY SH*T!!!!

      1. Sorry, Rand, but I’ve gotta call I.B.S. on you–illogical bull sh*t. There’s no rational reason for deliberately scrubbing a donor list only partially. What could possibly be the motive? Axanar has well over 10,000 donors. Take away 3,000 and, well, there’s still over 10,000 donors. It’s not like having 10,000 donors is going to look any better in court than having well over 10,000 donors. So I don’t see a motive or, indeed, any logic at all in the accusation. Occam’s Razor would say the simplest explanation is the most likely–that it was, in fact, a glitch.

        And unless you can prove that the following explanation from Diana Kingsbury is untruthful (I mean actually prove, not just accuse irrationally), then I’m going to take Diana at her word because she’s one one the nicest, sweetest, and most honest people I know. You, Rand, I only just met today…and I think most of my readers would agree: you don’t seem very nice or sweet. Just sayin’.

        Okay, so here’s what Diana said:

        * Not everything automatically ported over from the various sites when our technologist was importing data;
        * Ares Digital 2.0 is still in the Beta stage (meaning it remains a work-in-progess);
        * Omissions are infrequent but do happen; the most-common ones we’re seeing pertain to direct-through-Paypal donations;
        * Once we have the donor’s info–name, email used when donation was made, etc.–an account can easily be created for that donor in AD2.0 (after which point he/she will also show up on the Donor Roster).

        So if you have any interest in actually correcting the problem that seems to be bothering you so much, Rand, then I recommend you contact Diana directly (do you need her e-mail address?) and confirm with her your e-mail that was used when you donated, and she can create an account for you in the Ares Digital 2.0 system. If that’s not good enough for you, well, then I can’t really help you any more than I have.

        1. 3000 donor names missing and the entire retroactive donors list scrubbed and you call me a bullsh*tter? ROFLMAO!!!! Let me make clear Jonathan I never accused Diana and this all happened AFTER Terry left Axanar. 3000 names and an entire donor roster suddenly disappear there is only one person that would have been aware of it and I am sure you know who I refer to. I have no interest in is being lied to Jonathan. I find it ridiculously funny that not one at Axanar productions noticed this before now and the donor list and names have been missing from the donor roster for several months. Now here I am bringing it to light and now they are scrambling to recover it. Do you see the irony. Now that’s what I call bullsh*t!

          1. Rand, you know, when I contacted you earlier today, I was genuinely trying to help you. You didn’t have to go full asshole and block me. I wasn’t trying to act like you were stupid, like you insinuated, but rather I was trying to figure out how you came to the conclusion you did. It wasn’t all that long ago you thanked me for my wisdom and advice, so I didn’t think I would be rejected out of hand.

            Now that I’ve done a little poking around, I’m starting to see holes in your story.

            1) You claim 3000 names scrubbed from the list. Not even Sandy claimed that when he first penned his spreadsheet comparison! Assuming Sandy did capture all the names properly, there is an aggregate increase on the roster of 1115 names across the three lists on his spreadsheet. At present, I have no idea if names were previously on wrong lists and were subsequently shifted around, as I still have to assess the data.
            2) You claimed these 3000 names were the “Retro Donors List”. Until 12/29/15, the only list on the roster was the Prelude Kickstarter list. From 12/29/15 to today, the roster includes the Axanar Kickstarter and Axanar Indiegogo lists. There has never BEEN a “Retro Donors List”. Furthermore, your name has been listed under the Axanar Kickstarter List since 12/29/15, and shows up in every version of the page saved on the Wayback Machine, and on the current version of the page.

            I still have a lot more to go through to get to the bottom of this. But just what I’ve gone through so far pokes some pretty sizable holes in the veracity of the story you’re trying to sell. Right now, though I’m just having a hard time trying to figure out if you have simply turned into a dirtbag, or are being someone’s patsy.

          2. How much you want to bet this is the one FAN FILM FACTOR comment on this issue that does NOT get screen-capped and posted to the CBS/PvAxanar Facebook group?

      2. I did not know about it Rand. WHY DIDN’T YOU CONTACT ME?

        Problems don’t get resolved unless we know about them. Not sure how it works in yoru world, but in technology you actually have to know about a problem to fix it.

        Again, why didn’t you contact me?

        Alec

        1. I’d actually like an answer, too. It seems very disingenuous to me that Rand is complaining so loudly about something he never bothered to report. I think we all–all the readers, that is–deserve an explanation of why you, Rand, were trying to use this blog as a platform for an accusatory rant without once contacting the person who could address your problem.

        3. Alec,

          The problem is the simple fact that over the years you have earned a reputation as being not entirely honest.

          Messing with peoples heads and doing things that make people question your integrity isn’t good for business. IF I was in Rand’s shoes you’d be in hiding like you were at the Vegas Khan…

          Best thing you can do is stop burning people, cause some day your gonna run into someone you did wrong ………..

          1. Alec was hiding at the Vegas con? I hadn’t noticed. Of course, I only ran into him in open places like the convention floor, the bar, and the Axanar room party. Oh, and we had dinner with some friends. Maybe he was hiding during that dinner since it was at the Bellagio and not the Rio. Of course, the friend who treated us was staying at the Bellagio, so I’m not sure that counts as hiding. I know that I wasn’t hiding…was I?

  16. ” Omissions are infrequent but do happen; the most-common ones we’re seeing pertain to direct-through-Paypal donations;”

    3,000 donors… THREE THOUSAND DONORS are missing between the lists from March of 2016 on the Wayback Machine and the present list.

    Thats not infrequent…. out of 10K donors, that’s 30%….

  17. I contacted Diana on Rand’s behalf immediately after I exchanged messages with him, and she was able to correct the problem for him after a few minutes’ search. However, when I tried to message him further to tell him he was restored to the Donor List, he had apparently blocked my account. I don’t know exactly where he picked up this bizarre conspiracy theory about thousands of retroactive donors being purposely “scrubbed from the files” for some imaginary nefarious purpose, but simple logic concludes the mere disappearance of someone’s name from a dynamic webpage couldn’t erase all records of that person’s contributions from the payment processing company, too. What’s more believable–some shadowy collusion between Axanar, Kickstarter, and PayPal to keep a name from appearing on a donor list? Or that a data file wasn’t included when the fulfillment system had to be redone?

    I’ve posted a notice on the Axanar Fan Group instructing others who might find themselves not listed on the Donor page how to contact Diana to rectify the problem, and notified Axanar webmaster Bill Watters of what happened so he can investigate the missing data issue from the server side.

    That’s about all anyone could do to rectify the Donor List issue, unless the Illuminati let Bigfoot tell Rand’s source where in the Bermuda Triangle he parked the black helicopter full of unobtainium-edged USB drives containing stolen donors’ souls, of course. Good luck with that…

    1. “What’s more believable–some shadowy collusion between Axanar, Kickstarter, and PayPal to keep a name from appearing on a donor list? Or that a data file wasn’t included when the fulfillment system had to be redone?”

      I actually agree with you Reece…. between nefarious designs or gross incompetence, Axanar continues to demonstrate that they are to grossly incompetent to pull off anything nefarious by design….

  18. I am not going to buy the excuse 3000 donors names and an entire donor list was deleted by Terry because Alec, you’re making up an accusation you cant prove. Why would Terry delete it? Even better question is why would he delete when he knows possibly donors could be called as witnesses for the plaintiffs? That would be pretty stupid and I do not think Terry would be stupid and do that.

    Sorry I am not buying it today and tomorrow doesn’t look good either.

  19. Jonathan your a TOOL! Enough said. If you think Alec did not know or wasn’t aware of missing donor names and an entire donor roster listing, I got a bridge in New York for sale. 300o and possible more names deleted smells like someone was trying to hide something.

    Reece, when I left ISWA, I left ALL the Axanar related groups I want nothing to do with Axanar anymore. I don’t give two shits about my donation and I wont be ask for a refund I know I wouldn’t get anyway. Fact of the matter is this, 3000 missing donor names and an entire donors roster disappears looks awfully suspicious…. Ya think???

    This is not about me.

    1. Oh, Rand, your a…well YOU’RE a person who doesn’t even know when to use an apostrophe! 🙂

      But seriously, man, get some help. This is just bothering you WAAAAAAY too much. It’s so not your (not you’re) problem. Alec is the one getting sued. He’s the adult in the room. You’re just a guy out there in a tin foil hat watching the grown-ups playing a game that you really don’t have the first clue about. And that’s okay. I’ve noticed you’re getting very popular at the children’s table over on Facebook. You just keep playing with your little friends and have a nice time. Just don’t throw a tantrum when the party’s over, okay? You still have to go home and take a bath before bed.

  20. Man condasending much.

    Rand is upset and from his point of view quite rightly so.

    So instead of talking to him like a child and just dissmissing it out of hand as “hater lies” how about you take what he says at face value and actually treat him like an adult and as a concerned donor regardless of they way he puts things he has a concern that should be addressed by all parties as legitimate even if! it can be proven as incorrect.

    But then again you guys at Axanar and all associated with it have never been good at criticism in any way and tend to revert to name calling it’s almost like the unwritten rule. When all else fails name calling will do.

    Smh.

    1. I’m had a hard week, James. I apologize to Rand for being condescending.

      Fortunately, his issue was dealt with and his name is back up where he wanted it. So at least it all ended the way Rand wanted it to. Problem solved.

      1. If you have had a bad week then fine but that still does not excuse the way you spoke to him.

        I know you are having a hard time atm but if you can not seperate personal and professional then do not reply to people just say thanks for the comment so people know you have read it.

        I am not the biggest fan of Rand as we have had run ins in the past but not even I would not talk to him in this manner about something like this.

        I just hope ypu speak to Rand personally to apologise.

        1. As you saw, I did apologize to Rand directly in a comment and will not be engaging with him again. My father was taken to the ER a few nights ago, and my mother was terrified. They’ve been married for 52 years, and my father is 84. I had a sleepless night the night before I commented to Rand and still had to wake up early to take Jayden to school and then work for 90 minutes with a client. I was waiting all day and part of the night (as were my parents) for word back from the neurologist. During that time, I wrote my comment to Rand.

          This is not intended as an excuse…only as a reason. I actually try to be civil on this blog, but man–some of you do NOT make it easy! And when your dad’s in the hospital 1,000 miles away and your mom is taking all you have to give, well, there’s not much left for civility. So again, my apologies. (I wonder if anyone will apologize back.)

      2. Oh PLEASE, but “having a hard week” is NO EXCUSE for being rude, crude and condescending. You knew your behavior was bad and you cannot hide from it. You’re not exactly about your feelings and to top it all off it’s ONLINE for the whole world to see. Take some responsibility and stop with the lame excuse.

        1. “Oh PLEASE, but “having a hard week” is NO EXCUSE for being rude, crude and condescending.”

          So what is your excuse then, Tom? You’re not exactly practicing what you preach now, are you? My hard week involved my 84-year-old father being taken to the ER in the late evening and my mother calling me terrified. The rest of the night was kind of a blur, but it did not include a lot of sleep. The following day included a double-MRI and a CAT scan.

  21. For a blogger who wants to tell the truth about Axanar Jonathan, you sure are making a point to remove comments that don’t fit into yours and Alec narrative. Especially my last telling Alec he never takes any responsibility for own screw ups but loves to make excuses and blame others. Terry is a testament to that fact.

    1. I remove comments that don’t fit into my and Alec narrative? Have you looked at the comments I’ve been approving, dude???? Even yours! Even this latest one that says Alec “…never takes any responsibility for own screw ups but loves to make excuses and blame others.” I don’t think that one matches my and Alec’s narrative. You be trippin’, man!

  22. Wow…. when it comes to people who support Axanar, you guys take the cake. I am very stunned at you Jon. Rand’s concerns are valid. Instead of criticizing him and talk down to him, why don’t you try to get the bottom of things. As a former SFI member, I am ashamed of your actions. How about the critics call you name and tell you that “you still have to go home and take a bath before bed.” You’re a disgrace that I hope that you can explain to your family your actions. This can go one or two ways. You can either being supportive or you can be trouble. Remember, the internet NEVER forgets and I hope this sad pitiful pro-Axanar forum you call “Fan Film Factor” gets someone who is for ALL fan films not for just one. You may cover every other fan film but anyone with a brain can read between the lines of your… what you said to someone earlier their I.B.S. – your “Illogical Bull shit”. Don’t you dare call yourself “Fan Film Factor” if you won’t praise every fan film out there.

      1. I don’t have bitterness in my life… unless its a very bad film that wasted 21 minutes, 10 seconds of my life. Asides from that, I have a happy life. I call it like I see it and from what I see – “Prelude to Axanar” is not even on a pedestal compared to everyone else. If this was a real Hollywood film, it would have been shelved – never to see the light of day. You wanted bitterness – there you go 😉

  23. How many times did I point out there are still 2999 or more other donor names missing? I even stressed it was NOT about me. How incompetent do you need to be not to see it was about the ENTIRE RETRO DONOR LIST!

    Wow my name gets added back…WHOOP DE DOO!!! So when will all other missing donor names be restored???

    The incompetence is strong with you!!!!

    1. So I think we’ve reach a point, Rand, where we’re just not going to change each others’ mind and, in frustration, will resort to hurling insults. I don’t know about you, but I’ve got soooooo many better things to do than be insulted or accused or forced into a position of having to defend Alec or Axanar for something that doesn’t really affect me. They fixed your problem, there aren’t 3,000 missing donor names…believe whatever you want. I just need to move on–there’s just too much else in my life right now and way too many comments to read and approve.

      So I apologize for insulting you, for being condescending, I even apologize for all the things I started to type about you and then erased before posting. At this point, if you want to keep on arguing, you’ll be the only one in the boxing ring.

      1. Fixed the problem??? WTF!!! All you did was ignore the my entire point that is WAS NOT ABOUT ME, it was about the entire Retro Donors list.

        So you think adding my name back to a GOD DAMN donors list I NEVER DONATED TO fixes the problem and you think it that will get me to shut up??? OMFG!!!! IM SPEECHLESS!!!
        Nice try NO cigar. There is still a whole damn list of donors who had their names scrubbed and THAT IS WHAT THIS IS ABOUT. Waybacks web page records says you all liars, my own eyes say your liars and those that researched the donors lists says you all liars.

        Want to make me happy? Stop lying and restore the entire Retro Donors list because that is all this has been about! Nothing else!

  24. Hmmmm… wonder why you’re afraid to approve my comment with Terry’s quote? I actually defended you and gave you credit for always approving all comments earlier today. If you don’t approve that one you’ll have lost all credibility.

    1. My day so far:

      12:30am – Take Jayden to the potty so he doesn’t wet the bed.
      12:45am – Head off to sleep
      6:30am – Alarm wakes me up; Cubs won the World Series, more Wikileaks emails, DOW and NASDAQ are down in early trading
      6:45am – Shower, shave, brush teeth, get dressed
      7:00am – Wake up Jayden
      7:10am – Still waking up Jayden
      7:15am – Making sure Jayden gets dressed
      7:20am – Make breakfast for Jayden, lunch for Jayden, ready his backpack for school
      7:40am – Sneak away to computer for 10 minutes to read e-mail, approve a comment or two
      7:50am – Put sunscreen on Jayden, make sure he kisses Mommy
      8:00am – Into the car, drive Jayden to school
      8:15am – Get to school, walk Jayden to kindergarten
      8:30am – Talk briefly with the principal (who is retiring next year)
      9:00am – Arrive at the children’s gym where I am currently filming “Mommy and Me” classes to edit together training videos for new staff (my only paying client at the moment)
      12:00pm – Leave gym and head to Baja Fresh to get salad for lunch
      12:30pm – Arrive home, sit at computer and start to approve comments for posting
      12:33pm – Approve Sandy’s comment quoting Terry (submitted at 4:00am local time)
      2:00pm (NOW!) – finally eat my damn lunch!!!

      Does THAT answer your question, Sandy?

      2. No your the ones setting up go fund mes for people who have squandered $1.5mil yet want more money for something that should have been made 2yrs ago regardless of the lawsuit.

        But hey hooooo I see its down now.

        1. Alec sent me a none-too-happy IM to take it own…NOW. I’m in a bit of trouble with Lord Garth right now because I didn’t tell him I was doing this. Oh, well…good intentions, paved roads, and all that.

  26. Rand about you making accusations about about 3000 donors missing so Alec could pocket the money. Tell me this. How does Alec pocket this money when there is a paper trail? How does he make Paypal, bank statements, credit card receipts disappear? How does he believe that 3000 donors will forget they donated, and never report the issue? How would he expect TWO sets of accountants (Alec’s and CP’s who will each carefully review them) to completely overlook this missing money, when their job, in order to keep it, is to report any irregularities to the proper government authorities (according to accounting standards)? Maybe you should read up on what accounts do, what their responsibilities are, and the penalties accountants endure if they miss-represent the truth…think Enron.

    The truth is Rand, to even consider a computer issue, Terry or otherwise, and believe without anything more than, “a haters gut feeling” that Alec would take money from a verifiable source is completely moronic, and something I didn’t expect from you. But then again, I didn’t expect you to fall in with people who had constantly attacked, insulted, made fun of, and created degrading videos of you (which they voted on before doing). With an added bonus of three of them stabbing you in the back recently by letting me know you’d given them information about me.

    I predict since you have no reply that answers my questions, you going to yell, “I don’t want to hear it!!!”again, like a two year old, and block, cut me off because that’s the person you’ve become. So please continue your rantings, continue to damage your health and reputation by screaming fire in CPvsA’s burning house. I also predict that the haters eventually will spit you out when they are done with you, because even haters, have no respect for a turncoat.

    1. Charles, Waybacks web page records says your all liars, my own eyes say your liars and those that researched the donors lists says your all liars.

      Charles I woke up and smelled the coffee. I have seen the LIGHT!!!! PRAISE THE LORD ( NOT GARTH ) and pass the PIE!!!

      1. Rand, Waybacks what? … No proof, no details, no common sense to even make a logical step toward any possibilities rather that the same old hater line about us being liars.

        Enjoy your new found attention for as long as you’re relevant to them. I’m sure since all you do is yell, “Liars” you’re a great asset to their team….Nice, you sound just the haters we used to make fun of.

        1. He means the Internet Way Back Machine (https://archive.org/web/), basically a site that scrapes other sites and archives content when it does… It can be pretty handy for recovering unrecoverable content (web developer, comes in handy when you have clients who delete entire pages then wait 3 months to bring it up) or comparing content on sites which have been changed.

          In this case I assume they have visually compared the two donor lists, to get the 3,000 number they are either working out a rough number or have copied the lists into a spreadsheet to compare (done this more than a few times for customers myself).

          Easy way to prove or disprove by pulling up the archives before and after they say the names went missing and run a comparison, it can be used to prove whether Terry could have been the cause if there are archives after he left before the names they say went missing (not a definite though as most sites only get hit once every couple of months by them, they aint Google).

  27. Hope your dad is feeling better soon! =)

    FYI: Carlos P. seems to be a featured writer now over at trekmovie.com; and he is quoting you in a quasi-piece-by-piece rebuttal / hatchet job

  28. Wow, what total bullshit. 3,000 donors are NOT missing. Utter nonsense. And some insane hater conspiracy that I am pocketing donations? Wow, talk out of your ass much?

    But please, continue the utter nonsense. You will do so without me.

    1. Okay Alec, why is there an 800 Person discrepancy in the count of donors for the Prelude to Axanar Campaign Donor list in March of this year on the Wayback Machine, vs. the current list on Axanar Productions’ website?

      1. I think Sandy and Dave are going to enter the Wayback “cage” for a death-match of dueling proofs or something. Me? I’m staying out of it. And Alec…well, I think he’s in settlement talks today. Monday’s discussions lasted into the early evening!

  29. Johnathan,
    first i hope your dad is feeling better……

    holy hell what a nightmare of a comment thread. I donated to Axanar, I admit it….hell I even know the day I donated to Axanar’s kickstarter….not from a “donor list” but because my personal bank statement shows it. so there is no way it can get “scrubbed”, because I STILL HAVE THE PAPER TRAIL.

    Could Alec have ‘hidden” names, it is possible, but to what end. Do you really think CBS/P, wouldn’t use every means at their disposal to find a COMPLETE Donor List? If they thought their was a mistake, they can subpoena Kickstarter, and Paypal for records.

    I find that being in numerous facebook groups, you are either a supporter of Alec, or you think he may be the worst person on the face of the earth…..the truth I am sure is somewhere in the middle.

    Rand has spent countless comments bitching about missing donors, and when offered up 3 or 4 different solutions, and private ways to rectify his concerns, proceeds to simply continue to bitch. we get it, you hate Alec….get over it already, it is not healthy.

    I won’t say anything bad about Terry, Sandy, Carlos, Johnathan etc….because no matter which side of the argument you are on, you have staked your claim to that opinion on your own(at least i hope so), and no one should fault you for it.

    As to the lawsuit, those who predict doom and gloom for Alec and his supporters, have never seen or just don’t want to acknowledge that courts can and will do strange things. hell go back 20 years, everyone KNEW OJ was guilty, but he did not get convicted.

    I expect the answer will be somewhere in the middle, Alec won’t get “ruined” like his haters want, because courts don’t work that way, Axanar may or may not get made, and if so, not in the form that was originally planed. CBS/P will still hate Star Trek and its fans…..and the next “fan film WILL get Sued, because that is how lawyers make their money.

    And before you ask….I worked for 25 years in the music industry, so I know how this stuff works, and my father was a lawyer for 45 years, so I have a healthy understanding of how the law works…..or is supposed to

    1. Wise words, my friend. I wish we had more people like you commenting.

      And yes, the truth about Alec is “somewhere in between.” He’s a really nice guy who can also be a real dick sometimes…just like most of us. 🙂

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